~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Abused women are NOT 'codependent'. It is abusers, not their partners, who create abusive relationships.
-Lundy Bancroft
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
i came to those forums I write so much about beaten and bloodied and battered... but not completely ignorant... everyone knows victims are not responsible for their abuse... and yet... on these forums for abused women... allegedly run by abused women... it was ALL I HEARD...that it was my CHOICE and I was RESPONSIBLE... and i couldn't help but wonder why.... so i posted... and clung to what i KNEW IN MY VERY SOUL to be true... that i was in no way responsible for my abuse at the hands of a monster... one who had murdered a dog... abandoned his own children... robbed and pillaged and plundered and used his own parents with wild abandon... a predator... and anyone he gets near is fair game...
yet the women on these forums persisted... i resisted... it was all so familiar... they used the exact same tactics the Psychopath had used on me... and it became crystal clear... that i was not surrounded by abused women... but by abusive women...
~
let's start at the ending... BinkStink (one of these forums I speak of above's anointed) last post on her personal blog as of yesterday...
let's take some pertinent excerpts... and examine them... bit by bit... piece by piece... let's autopsy a living breathing blogging monster...
AUTOPSY OF A NARCISSISTIC ABUSER...
PART ONE
I'm afraid that . . .
January 4th, 12:14
I have given a platform to a very disturbed individual. One who does not desire real dialog on relevant issues, but to prove her point. People who offered her, in the least, a listening ear have been rewarded with hundreds of verbally abusive posts. I knew I would reach the end of my willingness to participate, and I have.
On the bright side, we have a real life Faustian dialog between an abuse survivor and a verbally abusive person. I suspected this was the case from the beginning, which is why I posted the "Camping with Abuse Survivors" entry. Mephistopheles was not able to make credible, thoughtful contributions the way the literary character was, but not everyone can be a good Mephistopheles. I'm banning her from my journal.
Sorry to everyone and ANYONE who has had their eyeballs scalded by the nastiness and vile hatred that has been spewed across the page. No more platform will I provide for that, hers, or my own.
she has most certainly given platform to a very disturbed individual...
herself...
and you will soon she that it is she who has no interest in relevant issues... as her point, as with all Narcissistic Abusers, is to CONTROL AND ABUSE others... and as with all abusers... she hasn't BANNED me... she has simply stripped me of the ability to defend myself... (how many of you have been the target of a smear campaign at the hands of your abuser when you call them on their bullshit?... that you're scorned, crazy, psycho, disturbed, a bunny boiler, a stalker... etc etc... are the similarities for BinkStink's 'ABUSER'S CLOSED SYSTEM OF LOGIC' hitting you yet? Something she learned from her cronies at the CATBOX and OUR PLACE!)
and you will see that there is certainly a dialog [sic] between abuse survivor and abuser... but that it is she who is the abuser... anything i volley back at her is reactionary... although, as with all abusers... she will point her finger and accuse me of being the abuser... and the 'hundreds of abusive posts' she is lying about... it was ONE post... one she considered threatening... because it was the one in which i pointed out her schizophasia... this line being an example... but far from the worst one... "Mephistopheles was not able to make credible, thoughtful contributions the way the literary character was, but not everyone can be a good Mephistopheles."
here's what schizophasia is - now just compare this definition to what BinkStink says in the above quote from her blog:
Schizophasia, also known colloquially as "word salad," is a mental disorder characterized by confused, disorganized usage of words. Although the words may have a loose, thematic relation to the specific question asked or topic at hand, parsing a specific meaning from them is difficult or impossible.Schizophasia is best known as a common symptom of schizophrenia, although it can also present as a symptom of a variety of other mental illnesses. It is also possible for schizophasia to be the sole symptom of mental illness, in what is sometimes termed "asymptomatic schizophrenia," although in some cases it is an early warning sign in patients who later develop more severe illness.
and now... to the beginning... you are about to see many common abuser tactics in use... in print... it is common for an abuser to cut their intended prey away from the 'herd'... single them out....divide people into 'camps'... single them out and set them up... and this is exactly what BinkStinks does... don't ever think an abuser is not fully aware of what they are doing... just read this quote from her...I suspected this was the case from the beginning, which is why I posted the "Camping with Abuse Survivors" entry.
this is a 'partial truth'... the only kind abusers ever tell... she is admitting she has done it... but is lying as to her reasons...
and now... on with the show... my invective will appear in purple...
Camping With Abuse Survivors (by BinkStink)
December 17th, 2009
It is too simplistic, i know, but it seems like the victims of interpersonal abuse are in two camps.To make it worse, I'll only focus on the extreme, the stereotype "character" that populate these two groups.
Keep in mind that I have a bias toward the idea that abuse is abuse, and that individual's subjective suffering is as real, and horrible, as anyone else's.(watch this line come back to bite her on her abusive Narc ass) No one corners the market on greater suffering.(same with this one) Not because I think that the suffering is completely relative, I don't. No one's suffering is so great that it justifies really awful behavior. Unless you are mentally ill. So keeping that variable nice and flat is important.
OK. We have Brenda, a 46 year old woman married twenty six years to Brent. Brent is a turd. He is an abusive waste of space. I don't care if he's really a PERSON beneath that loathsome exterior. Insert your own experience here. He screams at Brenda in public. He physically abuses their son. He has forced her to have sex against her will. He has made favorite pets "disappear", cherished items savaged in revenge for Brenda's inability to fill his huge HOLE where his soul should be.
Brenda realizes she is being abused. She joins a support forum. She is validated over and over again until she begins to validate herself a little more. She feels defeated and hopeless, but sees herself in the other members. She bumbles around, starting and stopping, coming and going, for a length of time and then she leaves him, or consciously chooses not to.
She thinks, HELL NO, I am outta here. She moves on and leaves the support forum (or stays on as support), and runs away from the pain. Not in the "bad" way, but she goes in a different direction, and starts throwing off the chains and beatings and nasty words until she's free of them.(this of course was her describing herself, as she must be deluded into believing she is)
Then, we have Carol, a 46 year old woman married twenty six years to Chuck. Chuck is a turd. He is an abusive waste of space. I don't care if he's really a PERSON beneath his loathsome exterior. Insert your own experiences here. He does the most horrendous things to punish Carol for her inability to fill his huge HOLE where his soul should be.Carol realizes she is being abused. She joins a support forum. She is validated over and over and over again, until she begins to validate herself. She feels defeated and hopeless, and is just not impressed with the stories of others. It's just too much, Chuck took the best years of her life and shat upon them. There is nothing left, and no getting back what was taken. Life, because of what Chuck did, has become a long slow fuck in the ass. Carol is broken and dammit, she'll be the first to inform you. She does not run away from the pain, she embraces it. I'm a bit biased here too, I think it bites her head off in the process, but in any event, Carol finds HER way forward, from Ground Zero of her abuse.
Unfortunately, Carol tends to be BANNED from the more conventional abuse support forums, or leaves in disgust. (this is her describing ME, as she has deluded herself into believing what I am )My hopes are that Carol DOES find connection and continued healing. But I can't see HOW. I am ready to admit that I literally can't see it. Sorry for my blindness. Oops, more bias, and you can see I have the brain of a toadstool ( no shit) and guess which "camp" I belong to.
These two camps end up warring with one another, either overtly or by ignoring the other as if it doesn't exist. They reject each other like magnets . . . which is really an interesting metaphor, but I'll lose my train of thought. They either accept the other side as "ill" or "young" or "misinformed" or "incredibly stupid". Sometimes, there is vitriol and attacks. Good gawd, you'd think for a bunch of people who went through the same damn thing . . . well, never mind.I think open dialogue between the two camps is in order. I mean, think about it. Both sides are missing exactly one half of the picture.
Let me tell you how hard it is for me to give relative value to BOTH camps. It is making my eye twitch. Could there be something, of value to us in the "I'm outta here" camp, in the "I'm fucked forever and that's OK" camp?? Could we be trying to fly too high, doomed to the fate of Icarus? And could there be something of value for the Fucked Forever camp from us from the "I'm Outta Here" camp? like a LOT god help them
BinkStinks was fishing for 'open dialogue'... ie... a victim to attack... i decide to reply...
fucked forever
i don't think those in the 'fucked forever' camp signed up for it... they just end up there....there are varying DEGREES of everything.. .from burns to abuse...i think those who suffer 'first degree abuse'... they have a far better chance of going to 'i'm outta her camp'... those with 'third degree abuse'... burned to a crisp..inside and out...makes it hard to 'get outta here'... and through no fault of their own...so it's a matter of degree... all abuse is not the same.....has everyone who has been abused been hurt?... sure... but just as someone whose finger is nicked with a butcher knife suffers a wound... it's doesn't compare to the wounds of someone who has been repeatedly stabbed up to the hilt to the knife...
i consider myself to be in the 'fucked forever' camp... not because i want to be in that camp... but because i AM in that camp... that camp is like the Hotel California... 'you can CHECK OUT anytime you like... but you can never LEAVE'... and i can say that most of the people who have insisted that i am NOT in that camp... them saying it was a whole lot more for THEIR benefit than mine... if they can trick THEMSELVES into believing every story COULD have a happy ending... and blame the camper, if it's the FAULT OF THE CAMPER... it makes THEM feel SAFE... they'll never end up in the FUCKED FOREVER CAMP... nope... because they're not LIKE me... it's a coping technique that is just PEACHY for the BLAMER... but a living hell for the victim...
the bottom line is that some abused victims are ready willing and able to throw more severely injured victims to the wind... just to feel more safe themselves... this Not-me-Logic is the sickest and most lowly and pathetic of coping techniques... because someone who has already been victimized has to be re-victimized in order for it to be effective... human sacrifice in exchange for feeling better about yourself...
it stinks of NARC...
I work with cancer patients. There are two I have worked with in the last month, a thirty four year old mother of three with newly diagnosed metastatic breast cancer. Her PET scan, originally done to figure out what was causing all the pain in her shoulder, revealed massive metastases up and down her spine, the long bones of her arms and legs, the base of her skull.
The other is a thirty year old mother of four, newly diagnosed with metastatic colon cancer. It's in her lungs and liver, and turned her pelvis into a huge fixed mass that they don't dare remove. They gave her a colostomy, which I couldn't even talk her into LOOKING at.
the fact that this woman is a nurse makes her all the more frightening as a NARCISSISTIC ABUSER...can you imagine a better venue for an abuser than to be IN CHARGE of some desperately ill people???... OMG...
re: magical thinking...
I thought we all employed mirrors and lights. I don't think anyone doesn't . . . there isn't some radical purity that you are missing out on, that sets you apart.
It's like you are saying that the contents of your blog are dishonest, or meaningless. On the other hand, you must be writing it for SOMEBODY. For the FF camp.Would you say you are a fair representative of the FF camp?
What do you guys seek to do, to teach or get the word out on, for your fellow campers?
my response:Re: magical thinking......
adishservedcoldsure, the contents of my blog are meaningless... not dishonest... but certainly meaningless... maybe more to me than anyone... there are geniuses who can make words come alive... my words are more like doodles made on a cocktail napkin while waiting on a train... of no importance...
it goes on... i've told her my blog is unimportant... does it satisfy the nasty bitch?.. of course not... this is the perfect example of how an abuser can never be placated... instead she becomes more angry... more accusing... her attack goes on...In the meantime . . . you are a bonafide member of the abuse survivor community. (for now... i won't be for along... watch her change THAT tune shortly) What is YOUR mission, for the sake of other abuse survivors?
Your blog includes sites that you agree are helpful. Are they helpful to you? How do they help you? Why do you think they are helpful?
see her attack?... pointing her finger... trying to back me into a corner?... attacking my blog... attacking me... belittling me... questioning my motivations... defining me....
my response:
Re: Compelling . . .
when did i become a 'bonafide member' of the abuse survivor community???!!... are there certain QUALIFICATIONS that must be met???... a fucking JUDGING committee???... i thought the pain and suffering of all abuse victims was 'subjective'...
and i hope when you said that, you were inferring the definition 'PERSONAL... particular to a given person' and not the psychobabble definition of 'existing only within the experiencer's mind'... as for what contributions i intend to make... the answer is... NONE... i am too busy trying to find a way for my pets to SURVIVE.....
but now, as with all Narcs....no one's suffering ever equals their own... watch her start to BLAME me for my poverty... for my abuse... . watch her put words in my mouth... watch her assume what i think and feel... watch her assume a position of AUTHORITY....Answers: When you identified yourself as an abuse survivor. YOU stated your qualifications. YOU are the judgement committee.
It seems as though YOU have trouble acknowledging the value of subjective experience, YOUR OWN, as you deny your own involvement in the decision.I think you've given me a pretty good idea of what the Fucked Forever camp is thinking, if you are a fair representative
.(see how she starts to DEFINE me...she is telling me what i am representative of) Hope is bullshit.
Responsibility for healing lies outside yourself, is given to you or taken away by some "outer influence". This "outer influence" has seen fit to give other people healing, but has passed you by for some reason.
You yourself are powerless to make a difference for yourself, because the damage you incurred is final.
Suggestions in the vein of "what if something good DOES come your way?" are met with all the reasons why it never will.
And in the end, people who camp elsewhere are deluded and say insipid affirmations to themselves in the bathroom mirror every morning.
To your last statement there . . . oh do I ever remember finding a way for my pets to survive. Well, they were a herd of 25 goats, a couple dozen chickens and ten geese and two tom turkeys, 13 dogs and two cats. Oh yeah, and me :) I spent nine months trying to do that. No job. ATM gone. Five feet of snow for five months of the year. Temps that didn't go above 12 degrees for the same length of time. A well that froze, pipes that burst, firewood that I split myself from huge rounds with a wood grenade and a sledge hammer.
I ate out of boxes that came from the food bank. I was so unused to "real food" that when I finally gave up the farm and went to live with my sister, I had the WORST gas and diarrhea till my intestines repopulated themselves with better creatures. Good thing I quit smoking because I'd have blown myself to kingdom come.
(this is all way too much information, but she is on a roll). No wonder she gifted me a some powerful aromatic candles that first month. I was SO FUCKING HUNGRY. I used to go into her pantry and STARE at the food. I was delighted with the tiny jars of pickled artichoke hearts. I craved them. I just sat there and watched my farm DIE. And my heart died with it.
From March of 2008 to June of 2009 I lived in HELL. My sister made me re-home my Great Pyrenees after HER dog got into the GP's food and the GP got a little testy about it. She made remarks that my last remaining dog was on short time, too. One of my cats disappeared, forever. Her children fell in love with my other cat and I couldn't bear to take her from them when I finally did move out
.(now i see where this is going ...she is JEALOUS of me..that i have kept my pets with me..that i have kept my family together...my success is HER failure..and she is ENRAGED by it) I lost my credit. I was going to Coinstar with the nickels and pennies to buy food, exhange it with my sister for money, and put in my damn gas tank so I could go to work at a job an hour away. My car had expired tabs, I had no insurance, and my tires were bald. The whole thing is documented on the Catbox.
Without their support and encouragement, which I was WILLING to receive and take on blind faith, I wouldn't be sitting here watching my geese and chickens out my bedroom window.
( this is unusual for a Narc... they usually hog all credit for themselves... but this one has actually become an EXTENSION of a group of abusers... a BORG OF ABUSERS... they are as one)
I wouldn't be grumbling to myself about putting on cold plastic pants and going out in the blasted rain and mud to do FARM chores.I don't buy that ANYONE with a modicum of intelligence and willingness CAN'T HEAL. As far down as I went I wasn't going to stay there.
My experience has proven my position. It can't get any better than that..
. (she finishes her diatribe by comparing herself to me... i am an abject failure... because i am not her... heck, i can live with that)
she goes on to say:
I won't beat a dead horse. I just don't see any dead horses to beat. Nope, not even you :)
this translates to... the attacks will go one... she's just warming up...
i attempt to explain myself... defend myself... i bring up the fact that i have complex PTSD... anic attacks... anxiety attacks... which has not been properly treated because i have no insurance... and because i have found 'free therapy' to be far worse than no therapy at all...
PTSD
how about that?.....does that count?.. how about a world class case of PTSD?.. how about PTSD that is so bad i have intense anxiety attacks... in grocery stores... pet food stores..?
how about PTSD so bad that i cannot really function in day to day life?... how about it taking me HOURS sometimes... to force myself to go out for a bag of groceries?... it not only interferes with my life... it keeps me from having a life.
i sought help for it... begged help for it... and gotten NOTHING... except so therapy from someone so incompetent that it has made my PTSD worse... or is the fact i can't walk into a fucking walmart without having a breakdown going to be dismissed too?????
I wouldn't think of dismissing the terrible pain of PTSD,(we'll soon see this is a lie) or the person experiencing it.(she has already dismissed the person experiencing it) My own is not as bad as it once was.(of course not)
It seems as though a combination of time and baby steps forward has decreased the symptoms. It's weird, they can pop up at any time again, for no "reason". What gives me hope is that PTSD is a curable condition (this is a total lie and this one is going to get her in deep with the nursing board also) I've watched other people get better with their symptoms too. It also takes an extreme ongoing effort on the part of the sufferer, to not give up.(her recurring theme... i'm not trying hard enough... that's my problem, according to BinkStinks)
I was a psych nurse for 17 years, long enough I always "will" be no matter what else I do.(we shall see) I've seen me some PTSD. I've seen people who SHOULD have PTSD but are amazingly together. One gal that comes to mind was a co-worker who witnessed her father murder her mother when she was nine years old.
I've also seen people who are determined there is no help, no hope, and they are fucked forever.(again she is slamming me... blaming me... it's all my fault i have PTSD) I just don't believe it. I don't think anyone is hopeless, and I don't mean that to insinuate something bad about the person who has given up even trying. (OH NO...of course not) I just think they are wrong about themselves. And they are building their Fucked Forever prison themselves, one brick at a time.(i see... she's not insinuating anything... she's announcing it... people are to blame for their own PTSD!)
I tell you what's impossible. To try and reach out to a person who is determined to stay Fucked. Every thing you say to them is construed as an insult, a head game,(yes..because it IS) or the person reaching out is in hopeless denial. It's a very tight system, and self reinforcing. If YOU are fucked, then so is everyone else, so it doesn't matter what you do or say to them. You can abuse them, cheat them, tell lies about them, destroy them. Everybody is trying to do that to YOU, after all, so you're just dishing it right back out to them.
I agree you must have TERRIBLE PTSD. I also think it is not PTSD that causes you to be so fucked.(WOW..WHAT A SLAMATHON...a nasty abusive sanctimonious authoritarian manipulating blaming NARC BITCH has extended her hand to me ...to 'abuse me, cheat me, tell lies about me and destroy me'..and i'm not GRATEFUL...gee....imagine that!)
i tell her i'm seeing where this is going:
very familiar with this
adishservedcold
i get it... i do... been there seen it... no matter how hurt somone else is... you're hurt more... no matter what someone else has accomplished... you have accomplished more... people always come up short in your lofty estimation... and you are ENTITLED to have YOUR feelings hurt and to be angry... t irene... and the list of bitches on OP who dissed you.
a lot of whom are the same ones who dissed me... who treat everyone like shit... but i cannot... and you can get on your blog and talk about how sorry you are... while your hatchet man charlene rips irene to shreds elsewhere... keeping your hands clean... YOU are one who wants to play dueling suffering... not me...
30,000 people die from suicide every year in this country... are they also on the receiving end of your CONTEMPT... because they didn't 'get over it'... like you did???..
5 million people a year will suffer from PTSD... hundreds of thousands are on disability for PTSD... are they all objects of your contempt and scorn??... maybe you should get a job in a VA hospital... were you could attack scores of PTSD suffers... minimize their suffering... negate it... you said it to me yourself... you have little or no sympathy for any human being... it shows...
her twisted response:Re: very familiar with this
You attribute a lot of really negative stuff to me, like contempt, that I don't have.(hahahahahaha)Because I believe you could recover and find serenity and peace, you accuse me of minimizing your suffering and YOU.I dare to say you aren't familiar with "this" at all, because you aren't hearing me or recognizing my intention. (oh, i'm hearing you bitch..and believe me, i RECOGNIZE your intentions) You have me all figured out, (yes i do..and Narcs just hate to be figured out) put me in a nice little category that enables you to discount MY experience as denial and fear and YOURS as "real" and substantial.(OUTSTANDING example of PROJECTION)
That's really interesting because I think that denial and fear is more an aspect of your side of the camp than my own.Thus, this conversation... I don't want to prove you wrong. I already believe you are.(and of course that is all that matters) Each time you accuse me of these horrendous motives I am even more convinced you are.(here we go!!.. another typical Narc maneuver... she is painting herself as being a victim of ME... it is ME abusing HER) You don't have to defend your "rightness" to me, (that's what this attack is all about ... forcing me to defend myself) and I don't have to defend mine to you.(why of course not) You don't need me to agree with you, do you? For you to be OK with where you are?
i reply
Re: very familiar with this
you seem to think you have ME all figured out... and no, i don't need you to agree with me... it's you who keeps trying to get me to agree with you... . some situations are hopeless... that's reality... it's you who are projecting yourself onto me... if i am miserable beyond MY personal comfort zone with inside temps in the 40's... you come back with how you lived with with temps in -100 or something... if i say what MY personal limitations are... you counter back with yours... but YOURS have nothing to do with me... nd i know that mine have nothing to do with you... i would venture to say that most people think 'adishservedcold' is referring to that horrible horrible REVENGE... but it is actually about being cold... about being constantly cold...
people who know me... who truly know ME... know that i very much believe in MIRACLES... i have witnessed miracles... a couple in my own life... but i'm pretty sure i've maxed out my miracle card... my problems are immense... and cannot be fixed with positive affirmations or HOPE or a spa day... they cannot be fixed with psychobabble... or stacks of conflicting self help books... i cannot fix them... and i deeply deeply resent those who imply it is due to some WEAKNESS OF CHARACTER on my part... i've served more tours of duty than George C. Patton... (although i'm sure you've served EVEN MORE)...
i've posed this question before... but never gotten a reply...what i would like to know is... is the interest in my redemption really about ME at all???
NOW SHE BRINGS OUT TURBONARC TALLULAH...always sniffing around to attack someone...
mata_hari41
No, there are THREE camps. InfernoPurgatoryParadise, Dish dwells in the Inferno. "Abandon all hope, ye who enter here."
this is one of the two quotes that TURBONARC TALLULAH has committed to her apparently very small memory capacity... and i've seen it and heard hundreds of times...
shifting the blame
have you EVER considered that 'SOME PEOPLE' DO NOT abandon HOPE... but that perhaps HOPE itself ABANDONS SOME PEOPLE?????.. WHICH CAME FIRST?????????????...did those 'SOME PEOPLE' abandon HOPE before HOPE abandoned THEM... or was it PERHAPS the other way around????? again we're back to the NOT-ME, magical thinking merry go round... if everyone who is WITHOUT HOPE is to BLAME... because they have ABANDONED HOPE... while you EMBRACE it... then HOPE will never abandon YOU... it's quite shameful, really... very cowardly...
BinkStink spews back:
Re: shifting the blame
No, I don't.Hope springs eternal.(and so does the drivel from this NARC'S mouth) You have just as much access to it as the next human being. You are bright and intelligent and curious. You do not appear to have a thought disorder, ie, schizophrenia, you seem to participate in consensual reality. (which is a LOT more than i can say for this whack job) I think YOU abandoned hope, because you couldn't get what you wanted on your terms. (of course... i am to BLAME because BLAME is the name of her GAME)
MY RESPONSE
shifting the blame
i'm really worn out with your magical thinking... my teeth are bad... shall i just HOPE for new ones... or maybe get some PRO BONO????.. if i get sick or hurt, there is NO ONE to take care of my dogs... shall i just HOPE someone will come stumbling down the street of the impoverished neighbohood i live in and help me????
i owe thousand in back personal property tax thanks to the PSYCHOPATH and cannot tag my car... shall i just HOPE for thousands of dollars to all from the beautiful blue skies above me... or shall i ACTIVELY SEEK SOMEONE TO PAY THEM FOR ME... PRO BONO???
as with ALL MAGICAL THINKERS... serious, valid, REAL solutions to REAL problems are never addressed... it's all just vague, obtuse, hazy, indistinct, mumbo jumbo... designed ENTIRELY for the comfort of the MUMBLERS... someone with TERMINAL MAGICAL THINKING..like the case you have... can simply fling out some piece of obtuse spew of claptrap and call it 'advice'... then they can sigh heavily and say 'well, i offered my advice (non-existent..seen ONLY by the magical thinker) and they REFUSED TO HEED IT'... case closed... as with all magical thinkers... COLD HARD FACTS never come into play... that's because the fragile delicate magical thinker doesn't care for ANYTHING that can be construed as HARD, COLD or TRUTH... magical thinkers accuse REALITY BASED INDIVIDUALS who refuse to play along with magical thinking as BITTER and ANGRY... by brandishing those who are standing firmly in REALITY as somehow being WRONG or BAD... the confronted magical thinker can slip back into their nice safe snug comfort zone.....right between DELUSION and DENIAL... same with you Tallulah... you want to address the 6,500 plus soldiers who commit suicide yearly from PTSD.. you got some tired old quote to cover it???????
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts.” - Bertrand Russell
BinkStink's typical obtuse, insipid Narc response
Re: quotes
LOL, said the wolf to the grapes (she's starting to slip into some schizophasia here)
i go on to quote a expert in PTSD... who says it cannot be cured... and can only be treated by a therapist with extensive knowledge of and experience with PTSD... Narcs don't like facts... especially when the facts don't mesh with their bullshit... i then went on to add something else that didn't mesh with her bullshit...
Re: PTSD....
i can imagine people not HEARING what i'm saying...but when i'm putting in PRINT... it makes me think it's purposeful... i think i have said... over and over and over and over and over... that i have tried everything... there is no medical care for single women... no dental care for single women... no PRO BONO therapy for single women... and not even LEGAL AID... and to get the low-rent pointless laughable 'therapy' i've gotten, i had to LIE about where i live... it's all a joke... there is no real help... it just run around... you go to one, they say go here, you go there, they say go over there... you go over there and they send right back to where you started... and I AM NOT THE ONLY ONE WHO HAS SAID THIS...there were several members on OP who had had this very same kind of experience... and they were shouted down... but in pms we all agreed... there is no real help... none...
another poster who has been reading this blog... someone who also has PTSD... joins in...
a fellow PTSD sufferer
4everdifferent
adishservedcold - you are absolutely RIGHT! There is no free or pro-bono care for Complex PTSD victims - and the "free" medical care is AWFUL!!! I am in the NorthEast and unfortunately one abuse victim who waits to use the E.R. The runaround you get from providers, medicaid and even the DV places is awful... I am sleeping on the floor of a friend but I'm sure she's getting tired of me being here.
Complex PTSD is PERMANENT. There is NO CURE!! The meds make you sleepy, dopey or sick. No amount of wishing or "working on it" changes it - unless maybe you have a Time Machine.
uh oh... should BinkStinks attack or suck up?... what to do... she takes an air of AUTHORITY again...
Re: a fellow PTSD sufferer
Hi 4everdifferent, welcome :)Many people have had some, or a lot of response from meds and therapy. I realize there are some who don't. I worked in this field for a long time and there are those who don't get better and go on to lead very miserable lives.
it backfires and the Narc is challenged...
Re: a fellow PTSD sufferer
4everdifferent
are you suggesting that we PURPOSELY LEAD 'miserable lives'?
or that we PURPOSELY don't respond to therapy?
If so you shouldn't be working in this field... because that's not only unrealistic it's nasty.
BinkStink's quick backpedaling... sort of
Re: a fellow PTSD sufferer
Sorry if I came across that way ... (the Narc is sorry she got called on her bullshit) . I don't think it's purposeful. (in my case it is, though... right Narc?)
There's something else missing, and I don't know what it is for sure. I suspect it is that the person has processed their personal tragedies in such a way that they are convinced there is no possibility of recovery. I suspect, I don't KNOW. I do not feel that there is no hope for me. It's hard for me to understand it when someone insists they are fucked forever. Especially when they have it together enough to type legibly and write intelligently (and often hilariously, in adishservedcold's case lol).(uh huh... continued application of SUCTION and how insulting to PTSD sufferers to say that if someone can type and put a sentence together that they can't possibly have PTSD!) That woman is crazy brilliant (omg!! WHAT TOTAL GASLIGHING BULLSHIT)... but hopeless? I can't buy it.
Sorry :(I haven't "spoken" to you enough to know your sitch (or to determine if i can rip you to shreds) but you sound intelligent and you make perfect sense :P so I can tell your brain is wired normally (because after all, she's been a nurse in the psycho-atric field for 17 years - easy for her to diagnose via blog!). So I'm not sure you are hopeless either.
I have NO idea what to suggest, not that either of you are asking for suggestions, of course. (but we're gonna get them anyway, of course) I just don't buy it, I never have . . . yet over and over again, I've seen the evidence of people who don't get better and lead very miserable lives. (doesn't have a feel for this poster yet... and it's making the Narc a little bit nervous)
this poster responds beautifully...
Re: a fellow PTSD sufferer
what is it you just don't BUY???... you don't BUY the results of STUDIES... and RESEARCH?... you just don't BUY what PSYCHIATRISTS and PSYCHOLOGISTS and even the good ol UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT is saying????.. so it's the particular PERSON who is at FAULT???.. because of they way they have PROCESSED they 'personal tragedy'???
it's the FAULT of the PERSON, and not whoever or whatever PERPERTRATED the PERSONAL TRAGEDY????
so when you say that the problem lies in the PROCESSING skills of the VICTIM... are you not in fact BLAMING THE VICTIM AND /OR THEIR PROCESSING SKILLS?????????????????
but that's lost on BinkStink so right back to her NarcStandard Operating Procedure:
Re: a fellow PTSD sufferer
Hmm. You keep accusing me of blaming you.(gee, i wonder why?) I haven't (she has). I don't. (she does) I think where you get tripped up is assuming I am blaming. (GASLIGHTING... i'm CRAZY... she didn't say that. blah blah blah... more lies and backwards talk) That's more about you. You openly blame for your circumstances. (she does, BinkStinks?) I'm on a different track, or something. I'm thinking different thoughts. I say you are accountable, and in the end, responsible for yourself.(AND YOUR ABUSE) Who else could do it? And would they even do a good job? So far, no.(oops! ..here's her Schizophasia again)
In the end, it's not about blaming. It's about accepting that you might have to change IF, and I am capitalizing IF IF IF you desire to change.( you might HAVE to change IF you want to change... meds wearing off?)... I can already hear you say "I CAN'T CHANGE!!!" and I believe to the tips of my toenails that human being can change, but only if they want to.What don't I BUY? That you are hopelessly fucked. Sometimes people have had so much fucked up stuff happen that they forget there is much, much more. They wait for someone else to give them what they need. When people CANNOT give them what they need, they hate them and all they stand for.(PROJECTION...SHE SHOULD KNOW ALL ABOUT THAT SUBJECT)
Ultimately, it seems you feel no power to change your life. You wait for someone to rescue you, perhaps? I don't know. You tell me.(again attacking me & this poster, putting words in our mouths, and putting both of us on the defensive... didn't she say she'd worked with patients with PTSD and knew all about it?... yet BinkStinks seems clueless to understand how triggering everything she is saying is!!!)
she's about to be challenged again...
Re: a fellow PTSD sufferer
4everdifferent
good for you but it wasn't ME who 'convinced' myself - it was numerous therapists & a clinic - all who sat me down and told me the TRUTH - this is NOT CUREABLE... this is a LIFE LONG CONDITION... only MANAGEMENT...
yet over and over again, I've seen the evidence of people who don't get better and lead very miserable lives.
This alone should speak VOLUMES to you.
Like not blaming the sufferer and that DV resources are NON-EXISTANT
BinkStink backpedals... she can't remember a word she JUST said:
Re: a fellow PTSD sufferer
I don't blame the sufferer.(oh for God's sake!!! she JUST DID!!) I encourage them to find that tiniest spark of self will and begin to take steps, even mincing, imperceptable ones, toward the best life they are capable of making.
DV resources are NOT nonexistant. (and she knows this because... well because she's the ALL-KNOWING WIZARD OF BINKSTINKS!) They just aren't going to give you a house and a job and a good lawyer and an expensive, university trained therapist as a free counselor.(God forbid someone would expect a 'UNIVERSITY trained therapist'!.. as opposed to what... maybe a PRISON trained therapist?) They have people like you and me who have gotten far enough along in recovery that they want to turn around and help others as they were helped.Management of PTSD, long term, is better by far than being a member of the living dead.(so i guess she's agreeing without knowing it... that the DOMESTIC VIOLENCE industry is full of flakes and predators and not much else... the good people are few & FAR between...)
so, i smack the bitch upside the head with some FACTS... the Narcissist's worst nightmare... cold hard TRUTH... and a little of her own medicine...
Re: a fellow PTSD sufferer
when you say SOME never recover... what PERCENTAGE would you say is SOME?... and what would you say the reason is that those SOME do not recover?...
when you say MANY people have had response from meds and therapy... HOW MANY are you talking about?...
and HOW MANY had SOME response, and HOW MANY had a LOT?... do more have SOME response.. .or do more have a LOT of response???..
because the Ft. Campbell Kentucky army base was so concerned about the number of SUICIDES of PTSD sufferers on their base alone, they did their own study... and when it all added up it was estimate that the number of SUICIDES FROM PTSD about the veterans of Iraq and Afghanistan will EXCEED THE COMBAT DEATH TOLL... mostly due to INADEQUATE TREATMENT... that's quite a FEW... over 6,500 veterans kill themselves EVERY YEAR... that's quite a FEW... and of course there are not studies that have been done on the numbers of VICTIMS of DOMESTIC violence related PTSD who commit suicide every year, mainly because NO ONE GIVES A FUCK... 6,500 soldiers a year... dead from PTSD related suicide... that's quite SOME FEW... and 25 percent of ALL HOMELESS PEOPLE in the great UNTIED STATES OF BULLSHIT are veterans with PTSD... that's QUITE SOME FEW, wouldn't you say????...
in my case bink... you seem to be blaming ME... my REFUSAL to HOPE... or to seek PRO BONO therapy, hahahaha... so, what do you suppose the FAULT... the FLAW, the PROBLEM with those 6,500 soldiers a year who commit suicide is???.. is it what THEY are FAILING DO FOR THEMSELVES???.. or could it just fucking be that it is really what SOICIETY is FAILING TO DO FOR THEM???
i await your reply...
it will be a long wait... because the NARC decides to dance around the questions posed... by finger pointing... and eluding... and trying to redirect the subject...
Re: a fellow PTSD sufferer
I am focussing on the domestic abuse victims. I don't think either of us are qualified to DREAM we can identify with the experiences of soldiers in Iraq.(dancing away from the subject) I agree their suicide rates are chilling, to say the least.We have fought a very different sort of war, and I don't care how bad it was, comparing OUR PTSD to theirs is grandiose, and diminishes what they go through, IMHO. So won't compare them anyway.(no of course she won't ... and how DARE i compare PTSD to ... PTSD!) I have just had a different experience with therapy and recovery. (so everyone should be JUST LIKE her... according to her... how NARCY of HER!!!) All I have is my experience to go by, and of course, you yours.
Rather than take potshots at each other as we represent different points of view, I was hoping we could try to understand each other.(getting a little nervous here... she feels herself getting cornered) We are BOTH domestic violence victims. We have had some very similar experiences . . . the animal murders and assaults, the psychopathic death threats, the drugs, the terrible isolation, the complete loss of money and lifestyle to a mooching, greedy con men. (the old common ground ploy, a favorite of Tallulah)Yet I have hope. You say you have none. I have had a modicum of recovery of my self and have dreams of a better future. You say you are already dead and consider your defeat final. I say I was defeated and goddammit it's NOT final. Not if I have anything to do with it.(CONTROL FREAK BITCH)I have never once blamed you for your condition, yet you insist (by repeating yourself) that I blame you.(here we go again - not remembering what she's just TYPED AS CLEAR AS DAY)
It's not about BLAME in my book. It's about power and choice, in my book. But you say you have neither. And that is what I don't understand. So far you have not given me compelling information or reasoning to support WHY you have no hope or life left in you, other than that is what you have decided is true. And yet you deny that you made that decision, that it was made FOR you. For me, I did make a decision. I could choose to be bitter and angry and hate the world for what it did to me. (ooooh...look at this... now she is attacking me again...painting me as bitter and angry and full of hate... an Our Place standard) For all the losses and pain. Or, I could be a proponent of just the opposite.I nstead of shaking my fist at the fucked up world, I could build my own little corner, what is within my personal power, to be as decent and good as I can make it.
It IS a fucked up world, and I can't fix THAT. But I can fix myself. I can choose not to drag my friends and family and anyone I relate with into the pits of despair. I can choose to be uplifting. And I do, even when I feel like crawling in a hole and dying.(nowhere does she address what i have said in my post to her...)
and i call her out on it... Re: a fellow PTSD sufferer
i'm calling you out on this one... to aid in your personal growth... 'I think the subjective experience of being abused is sacred, in that judging another person's abuse as a "nick" versus "third degree abuse" is mere speculation. The subjective experience is not something you can honestly judge. Sure you CAN judge it, but I don't buy that in judging it you are being honest and fair.'
(it has come back to bite her on her ass) NOW........IS TRAUMA SUBJECTIVE... or is it NOT?????...not everyone who has been in MILITARY combat develops PTSD... and not everyone who has been in MARITAL combat develops PTSD... because ALL TRAUMA, all VICTIMIZATION is according to YOU... 'SUBJECTIVIE'... so... who are YOU to say that someone who has been beaten by their husband isn't JUST as TRAUMATIZED as someone who was in military combat???... since ALL ABUSE IS 'SUBJECTIVE'???
she gets a double whammy...
Re: a fellow PTSD sufferer
4everdifferent
I am focussing on the domestic abuse victims. I don't think either of us are qualified to DREAM we can identify with the experiences of soldiers in Iraq. I agree their suicide rates are chilling, to say the least.'
Exactly - and no comparison to DV victims - whose PTSD can be JUST AS if not MORE SEVERE in some cases... 'comparing OUR PTSD to theirs is grandiose, and diminishes what they go through, IMHO. So won't compare them anyway'
......No it isn't - doctors do it all the time.' I have just had a different experience with therapy and recovery. All I have is my experience to go by'
.. exactly... so why keep pushing "hope" and so on... you are then comparing YOU to the rest of us who were PSYCHOPATHY victims. Do you know that there's a new clinic in Clearwater, Florida for victims recovering from Psychopath Abuse? It's booked THROUGH THIS YEAR already and it's only been open 6 months... and no they won't do PRO BONO or compassionate care.
this is a tough one... can she attack me... while still attempting to ingratiate herself to a poster she's not sure about?... she decides to ignore the other poster and go after me...
Re: a fellow PTSD sufferer
How could you possibly KNOW that it is as severe or MORE? Have you been a soldier in Iraq? The doctors who compare have neither been DV victims OR war veterans.(oh, so now they're WRONG too) I don't see how they can know, either.(of course not... but she has no problem knowing they're wrong)The best I can come up with to JUSTIFY a comparison is comparison by metaphor. Yes, DV victims live in a war zone, but it is a specious war zone compared to what I imagine a TRUE war zone is over in the Middle East. It is helpful to conceptualize DV as a war zone and the PTSD as similar, but it's a huge jump to compare the experiences point by point. The metaphor fails, as most DO when you get right down to it(grasping at straws, here).
You think I wasn't a victim of psychopathy? Go check my story out on the Catbox.
I totally agree there is not enough help out there available. So we are forced to help ourselves, however we can. If you can think in a straight line, don't hear voices telling you to kill your baby from the heat vent, then you are probably capable of taking steps to help yourself.(i guess if you're not killing people YET... no professional help is required) I get the impression some people believe they CAN'T help themselves, and must wait for others to serve them. You'll be waiting forever. If you don't want to wait, start now.There is a whole other world out there, if you want it. BTW I have very recently done the government funded psych care routine. I didn't have the money to put in my gas tank to even go to the free counseling services offered to me, so I didn't go.(you all remember this line from my preview and i want to take a moment to really address this one!!...THIS BITCH IS A NURSE!!...SHE OBVIOUSLY HAS INSURANCE!!...SO WHY WOULD SHE NEED TO GO THE 'GOVERNMENT FUNDED PSYCH CARE ROUTINE'?....this is an OBVIOUS LIE..she works in a HOSPITAL!..is she trying to say she has no access to PSYCHIATRIC CARE IN A HOSPITAL??...i say this is either COMPLETE FABRICATION OR she herself is RIPPING OFF FREE SERVICES THAT SHOULD BE GOING TO THOSE , AS SHE PUTS IT....'MORE DESERVING!'..and one cannot help but wonder WHY if there is a shred of truth to what she's saying here...that she isn't using her INSURANCE for PSYCH CARE.??????...)It was all on me, and the support I was WILLING to receive from a bunch of women who told me I could do it if I wanted it bad enough. They were right. (where is this going??... she wasn't willing to submit to real psych care, for reasons become more obvious by the sentence, but she was willing to join forces with a bunch of abusive bitches on a forum?... isn't she saying that she has done what she is accusing me of?... turning down the help offered to her?)
i ask the question AGAIN.......
calling you out on it....
it appears you are taking it upon YOURSELF to judge someone else's level of trauma... a soldier who is sitting beside his best friend in a truck... and he sees him killed by gunfire... a woman who is sitting beside her best friend in a car that is hit head on and she sees her decapitated... now who has suffered more????... it is impossible to know...unless YOU are BOTH of those people... you didn't answer... .why do you suppose nearly 7,000 soldiers and nearly 4,000 other people commit suicide every year???... is it because they have ABANDONED HOPE... or could it be because HOPE HAS ABANDONED THEM?
there are two flavors of HOPE....it comes in REAL and it also comes in TOXIC... REAL HOPE is when there is EVIDENCE that CHANGE IS HAPPENING. TOXIC HOPE is a FALSE HOPE by which you are in danger of being harmed physically or emotionally by continuing to BELIEVE that things will change when there is NO EVIDENCE that supports it... .look down......you're knee deep in TOXIC HOPE.....
she's getting rattled...
Re: dancing around the question.....
I am not a war veteran, nor have I ever been SO suicidal that I took my own life. And my friend, NEITHER ARE YOU, and NEITHER HAVE YOU. Unless you are on PearlyGatesNet, but your ISP belies a San Diego location (watch her change the subject, since she's up against the wall). . . I lived there for eight years, we could have been neighbors, I could have admired your dogs as you marched them proudly along dog beach where I took my Jack and Boogie . . .and though it's expensive and BROKE down there, San Diego is Paradise, not Hell. At least when it comes to weather(DIVERSIONARY TACTIC..an obvious one..since she knows EXACTLY where i am..and that it is NOT San Diego) . . .
Your question I danced around doesn't seem relevant to the subject I thought we were discussing. It seems like a diversion, that's why I ignored it (couldn't be because the bitch couldn't pull a pat Narc answer out of her ass, could it?). I'm talking domestic abuse survivors and LIVING people.
And I think comparing ourselves to Iraq and Afghanistan war veterans and dead people is specious and borrowing more trouble than we actually have (especially when dragging them into the mix and BLAMING THEM would be tough)
she then resorts to pretending to be another poster... to change the subject... but i'm not buying it... and I stay on her Narc ass...
REALITY...VERY COLD... VERY HARD...
here's some REALITY... i am NOT in san diego... i fucking wish... right now it is POURING DOWN RAIN... and the moon roof on my car will not close... today i am supposed to go to job services... and they are SUPPOSED to help me find a job... the rain is coming down in BUCKETS... so i guess i can HOPE that my roof will close, right?... and i can HOPE that i won't get drenched driving it in the freezing cold rain, right???.. .or maybe i can find someone to close it for me PRO BONO... or maybe i can just PRETEND it's not raining into my car... i've had to drive that car lately in termperatures of 12 degrees!!!... driving around in 12 degree cold with the entire top of my car wide open...
oh well, i guess i should have just made an ADVENTURE out of it... it's not a big deal... this is my big throbbing problem with all you COMFORTABLY NUMB ,SELF DELUDING MAGICAL THINKERS... you invent REALITY... not just for YOURSELVES... but for everyone else around you... and when they refuse to live in the deluded make believe castles in the air you've constructed... it pisses you off... .what do you magical thinkers do when your breaks down on the freeway?.. click your hells together and chant 'there's no place like home?'...
well, shit... again she has no answers... so she starts finger pointing and telling lies... as a diversionary tactic... to call attention away from the fact that she is a RAGING NARCISSITIC MORON...
Re: REALITY...VERY COLD...VERY HARD...
It doesn't rain OR snow when it is 12 degrees. (I didn't say it did)You have arms and legs and if you can afford Dish Satellite (didn't say i had it) you can afford a roll of duct tape and a garbage sack to cover your moon roof. If you are wardriving on someone else's wireless internet, and sincerely can't afford duct tape or garbage sacks, I'm sure you could ask a neighbor nicely.
I signed up for daily work with the felons, too.(ddn't say i was working with felons) It really, really sucks. But none of what you say convinces ME I am not facing cold hard reality,(OMG!..the bitch really is crazy... the mothership needs to come claim her soon...) it more convinces me YOU aren't taking the most simple steps to take care of yourSELF. I wish you would :( Taking care of yourself, however you must, IS reality.(once again, she doesn't address my QUESTION... slick, huh?)
now here i'm righteously getting pissed...
Re: REALITY....VERY COLD....VERY HARD......
can you cannot comprehend the written word.????.. i didn't say it was raining or snowing at 12 degrees... i said i'd had to drive the fucking car in 12 degree cold.....i said it is pouring down rain TODAY... rain turning to snow... and that i had to drive it in the pouring rain... ok... so now you're REFUSING to believe it's raining somewhere in the world???... here's what i don't believe... i don't believe you've ever been in therapy... because if you had been... no matter how lame the therapist... i believe they would have pointed out to you how PERSEVERATIVELY (one of her favorite bits of word salad) delusional you are...dish satellite?????? and who said anything about DISH SATELLITE... i said my DISH account was screwed... i was talking about my ADISHSERVEDCOLD nickname... i've CHANGED my user name because of it... really...i hope you're not allowed to dispense medications..
Re: REALITY....VERY COLD....VERY HARD......
I apologize for misunderstanding, Zen. (no misunderstanding, and no apology..just pure BULLSHIT)
Cheap shots are pretty common unfortunately, I would wonder if you were ill or had a mishap with a meat grinder if she didn't send me a few good zappers like this one LOL!! (THIS BITCH IS MORE FULL OF SHIT THAN THE KANSAS CITY STOCKYARDS)
I respond:
Re: REALITY....VERY COLD....VERY HARD......
you know EXACTLY where i am... so stop being coy... and cut the crap... i know you know... i know which old battleship told you...
i decide to call her on her MAGICAL THINKING...
MAGICAL THINKING.........
i am somewhat familiar with it... i've seen it in action... the psychopath embraced magical thinking... and my famous faith healer uncle... people would come in DROVES.. .believing they could be healed... and some employed magical thinking to the point that they actually believed they WERE healed... for a short time... and then... then when they found out they weren't exactly as cured as they thought... they CONTINUED to embrace magical thinking... that is was GOD'S WILL... yeah... seen a lot of magical thinking...
and those who embrace it are NOT the self realized.. .the self empowered... those who have achieved great PERSONAL GROWTH... they are in fact the WEAKEST... the most DESPERATE... and what makes many of them OBNOXIOUS as opposed to PATHETIC is their sanctimonious self delusion... if you're too weak to live in reality, and just say so. then you are the true lost soul... that's another thing....but when you are too weak to live in reality.. .and then attack those who do live in reality... then you're a NARC...
The narcissist's favourite sadistic cocktail is brutal honesty coupled with "helpful advice" and "concern" for the welfare of the person attacked. The narcissist blurts out - often unprovoked - hurtful observations. These statements are invariably couched in a socially impeccable context;Prone to magical thinking, the narcissist is deeply convinced of the transcendental meaning of his life. He fervently believes in his own uniqueness and "mission". He constantly searches for clues regarding the hidden - though inevitable - meaning of his personal life.
and here comes the old battleship in question... BinkStink's proxy... chugging into the harbor... a firm believer in Magical Thinking... she is pissed that i have said it is often used by the weak and desperate...
Re: MAGICAL THINKING.........
mata_hari41
Well, yours is the antithesis of magical thinking to the point where it IS magical thinking. You doggedly and wholeheartedly believe your life is fucked forever and, by god, it IS.
another poster comes back at this additional sanctimonious Narc.....
Re: MAGICAL THINKING.........
4everdifferent
could there be something of value for the Fucked Forever camp from us from the "I'm Outta Here" camp?AND could there be something of value for the "I'm Outta Here" camp to LEARN AND GET THROUGH THEIR THICK SKULLS FROM THE 'Fucked Forevers'?
Like stop trying to tell us it's OUR FAULT!
save your platitudes for Oprah and admit you know nothing about how bad it really can be for many of us - dissed by the 'system' with no genuine help anywhere!
Uh Oh... BinkStink's digging a hole with her keyboard again... straight to Narc Hell:
Re: MAGICAL THINKING.........
It's not your fault.It's your responsibility. Huge difference, and the means to your freedom, if you want it. (a mixture of bullshit, psychobabble, doublespeak... mostly bullshit... again... so BinkStink's decided to go out on a limb and sling some BLAME at this poster too)
it doesn't go over well...
Re: MAGICAL THINKING.........
4everdifferent
'It's your responsibility. Huge difference, and the means to your freedom, if you want it'.
so the fact that shelters are full, won't take people with disabilities and some won't take kids, there's no jobs, I have no family, therapy didn't help me, medicaid won't do anything for me... that I spend every single day seeking out help... is MY RESPONSIBILITY? you simply don't get it won't get and have no intention of getting it.
THE NASTY NARC BINKSTINK FINALLY DECIDES TO ATTACK THIS POSTER TOO... since she can't shut her up with BULLSHIT ALONE...
Re: MAGICAL THINKING.........
You had to spin what I said pretty hard to get THAT out of it!Which one of us is smokin' the wacky again? If you twisted the words of the therapist, the employer and the case worker in this same manner, NO WONDER you are feeling so fucked.
PART ONE... FADE TO BLACK...
are you seeing it?... how she's doing it?.. the finger pointing... the blaming... the diversionary tactics?... did you EVER see this crazy BULLYING ABUSIVE NARCISSIST actually answer a question, or address her own behavior?... OF COURSE NOT!..
Manipulators use distraction and diversion techniques to keep the focus off their behavior, move us off-track, and keep themselves free to promote their self-serving agendas. Sometimes this can be very subtle. You may confront your manipulator on a very important issue only to find yourself minutes later wondering how you got on the topic you're talking about then.The evasion tactic is closely related to diversion, this is a tactic by which a manipulator tries to avoid being cornered on an issue by giving rambling, irrelevant responses to a direct question or otherwise trying to skirt an issue.
A subtle, but effective form of evasion is the deliberate use of vagueness. Covert-aggressives are adept at giving vague answers to the simplest, most direct questions. You have to have a sensitive ear for this.
Sometimes the vagueness is not so pronounced and you think you have an answer when in fact you don't. the tactic of DENIAL..this is when the aggressor refuses to admit that they've done something harmful or hurtful when they clearly have. It's a way they lie (to themselves as well as others) about their aggressive intentions. This 'Who...Me?' tactic invites the victim to feel unjustified in confronting the aggressor about the inappropriateness of a behavior. It's also the way the aggressor gives him/herself permission to keep right on doing what they want to do.
Denial as a lying tactic of manipulation is another in the list of tactics covert-aggressive manipulators (usually character-disordered individuals) use very frequently. I stress the importance of differentiating between denial as a defense and denial as a tactic to hide aggressive intent.Lying... the lies preferred by covertly-aggressive individuals are lies of omission. Damn, if those aren't the hardest lies to detect! They lie by telling the truth. It is what they leave out that makes it a lie.The sad, yet absolute, fact is that the default position when dealing with a narcissist is that they are lying. The anomaly with a N is when they tell the truth. They so seldom tell the truth that you don't even have to worry about mistaking that truth for a lie. They don't deserve to have us believe one thing they say or insinuate. If we presume that whatever they are doing, whatever they are saying, is designed to manipulate and deceive, then we are in a much safer and saner position.
Covert aggression:the tactics of the covert-aggressive are another form of lying. One of the first things their tactics accomplish for them is to conceal the fact that they are fighting with you. They are refusing to allow you to have the opinion you have, the standards you have, the decision you've made. They are attempting to force your surrender to their way, their opinion, their standards (or lack thereof). But the first thing they must do is come at you in such a way that the first thing you'll think is that they are reacting defensively. They hide their aggressiveness under a cloak of pretense that they are simply acting out of defensiveness which, of course, means that you attacked them. So the next thing their tactics accomplish is putting you on the defensive. Now you are knocked off-balance and the covert-aggressive will likely start throwing so many different manipulative tactics at you at once that you end up falling for the ruse and capitulate.
Minimization:the aggressor is attempting to assert that his behavior isn't really as harmful or irresponsible as someone else may be claiming. It's the aggressor's attempt to make a molehill out of a mountain... Neurotics frequently make mountains out of molehills, or 'catastrophize.' The disturbed character frequently trivializes the nature of his wrongdoing. Manipulators do this to make a person who might confront them feel they've been overly harsh in their criticism or unjust in their appraisal of a situation.Minimization is not primarily the way they make themselves feel better about what they did, it's primarily the way they try to manipulate your impression of them. They don't want you to see them as a person who behaves like a thug. Because they are most often comfortable with their aggressive personality style, they also want you to believe that there's nothing wrong with the kind of person they are.
http://www.cassiopedia.org/glossary/Covert_Aggression
as for BinkStink's endless defense of the abusive women on the big three abusive abuse forums:
it is an important point on whom the narcissist will bequeath her empathy: other abusers. This is a fundamentally selfish bestowal of empathy just as much as giving herself undeserved empathy is because by bestowing her empathy to the abuser what she is really doing is granting absolution and empathy for herself. She recognizes the kindred spirit in the other abuser and by excusing their behavior she excuses her own.
http://narcissists-suck.blogspot.com/2008/06/refresher-on-savior-complex.html
BinkStink accuses me of 'hurting' her and the other abusive bitches i unmask... of course she does...
Hurting someones feelings in the process of defending truth and principle is not a crime. Some people deserve to have their feelings hurt. Don't fall victim to the "cult of nice". Narcissists have taken full advantage of the now endemic belief that hurting someones feelings is a sin. If the truth hurts someones feelings, so be it. Too often people are unwilling to stick to and defend truth because someone may be offended by it. This is only advantageous to the covert and overt criminal. Society, churches, families are not benefited in the long-run by the evasion of truth for the sake of someones feelings. It is this reflexive aversion on the part of decent people that so often lets evil run unchecked.The truth is, the "hurt feelings" are a ruse when used by the character-disordered. Malignant narcissists are not experiencing hurt feelings... they are simply angry and annoyed at not getting their way. Know the difference between someone who has a legitimate claim to hurt feelings and someone who is just pissed off because they want what they want. The two are worlds apart. Getting hurt feelings for not getting your way is equivalent to a two-year old child throwing a tantrum simply because he wants what he wants. Let's not make it more than that.
thanks to Anna Valerious
STAY TUNED FOR PART TWO
